Libra63
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posted on September 20, 2003 10:06:29 AM new
Hold it! No shouting matches here. You are comparing Apples to Oranges. The fact is costume jewelry was made so that women that couldn't afford Cartier, Tiffany etc. could enjoy wearing beautiful ensembles. Of course a piece of costume jewelry would be worn more than the expensive items and would certainly wear out faster.
There are experts in every field and experts do not know everything Look at your book on Official Costume Jewelry by Harris simons Miller and read the overview and it tells a lot about costume jewelry. Fluffy and Kiara might be experts but there are others here that know something about it also. So what people sell makes no difference. All she asked when she came I'm here was Need help on old jewelry. She didn't ask for experts just anyone with a little knowledge which quite a few of us have.
bigpeepa the piece is worth only what someone will pay for it....Costume jewelry is hard to price. It is the taste of the buyer that reflects the price...
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kiara
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posted on September 20, 2003 10:37:14 AM new
Who is shouting? I don't see anyone shouting here. Something about message boards or people where they can read into sentences the tone of voice..........
The following statements are said in a calm and low voice as have all my previous statements.
I don't consider myself an "expert" on costume jewelry and I have never claimed to be. The conversation drifted to the quality of jewelry and I just stated that costume jewelry was never made with the durability to be worn daily.
It is also known as fashion jewelry, isn't it? To be worn for a certain period of time, such as trendy jewelry. Some women wore it for a period and then kept it in a box or jewel case. Others wore it and discarded it when the trend was over.
By discard, I mean that they got rid of it, either to a thrift store or by giving it away to a friend or relative. Perhaps a few even trashed it but when you look at the volume of it out there it does seem that the majority of pieces survived.
Reminder........ the above statements were said in a very low tone of voice.
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ohmslucy
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posted on September 20, 2003 12:42:42 PM new
I took the necklace to my estate jeweler and here's what he said.
It's a high quality costume piece, definitely worthy of restoration. Eastern European in origin, probably Austrian or Czechoslovakian, from the early '20s.
The three missing stones were likely pearls as the mounting cavities are a different size than the ones with the pink stones. The green stone is blown glass, made to resemble Chrysocolla.
The necklace is made of pewter with copper overlay. The wash is probably gold. The chain style and length is typical of the period. Necklines were higher then.
Lucy
Watch the donut, not the hole.
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rarriffle
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posted on September 20, 2003 01:03:51 PM new
lucy, thank you for letting me know what they said....I will keep that note with the brooch.
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ohmslucy
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posted on September 20, 2003 01:32:41 PM new
Hi Rarriffle,
You're certainly welcome! It's kinda fun to know someone has what might be part of the original set. Doesn't generally happen with something this old.
Oh, here's the necklace after Phase I of the restoration. So much shinier and no more green on the copper on the back. Next will be a trip to get the right color of pink stones... I sure hope the store has them in stock, otherwise I'll have to order them.
Lucy
Watch the donut, not the hole.
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AuctionAce
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posted on September 20, 2003 02:01:53 PM new
It is a high quality piece from the 20's.  It looks better than most of the stuff made today.
-------------- sig file ----------- President John F. Kennedy said, "There are three things which are real: God, human folly and laughter. The first two are beyond our comprehension, so we must do what we can with the third."
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miscreant
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posted on September 20, 2003 02:02:18 PM new
If that jewler thinks that is high quality, you should find another jewler who won't try stroking you. Notice the mountings for some of the red stones are rivited in and not part of the casting or soldered in place. It is cheaper and quicker to rivit than to finish off a casting or solder.
The reason for a white metal base with a copper coating than a gold wash is that it is easier and cheaper.
If anybody on this board knows cheap, it is Fluffy.
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trai
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posted on September 20, 2003 02:44:43 PM new
High quality? Not likely! Nice old time piece but not worth the money to so call "restore".
What is he going to charge you to restore this?
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ohmslucy
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posted on September 20, 2003 03:58:01 PM new
Miscreant,
I'm sorry if my picture misled you. I think what you're seeing as rivets are places where the copper has worn off the pewter base.
There aren't any rivets anywhere. The necklace is made of two castings, attached at top and bottom, with the small dangle held by a link. The larger casting is the back of the piece. It holds the green stone and most of the others. The smaller one - on top of the stone - is very much like Rarriffle's pin.
In any event, if my jeweler says it's high quality, I believe him. His 30+ years of experience are enough for me.
I do agree with you, though, if anybody on this board knows cheap, it IS Fluffy.
Thanks for your observations...
Lucy
Watch the donut, not the hole.
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ohmslucy
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posted on September 20, 2003 03:59:51 PM new
P.S. to Trai,
He doesn't charge me anything on restorations. Points me in the direction of where I can get the right stones, etc., then helps me with the repairs. He has a pretty snazzy microscope and tweezer-type things that are a BIG help in setting stones.
Lucy
Watch the donut, not the hole.
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CBlev65252
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posted on September 20, 2003 03:59:56 PM new
No matter what, Lucy, I still think it's a very pretty piece!
Cheryl
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ohmslucy
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posted on September 20, 2003 04:01:59 PM new
Thanks, Cheryl... So do I...
Lucy
Watch the donut, not the hole.
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miscreant
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posted on September 20, 2003 04:13:31 PM new
Well Lucy, I am at about 40 years expirience and people Ol' Fluffer has mentioned respect my opinion, in fact I consult for their books.
This is far from a "high quality piece" in fact any jeweler who said that is highly suspect. White metal base means cheap and to make it sound better, it is called pewter. I have handled, usually as briefly as possible, many of those pieces in estates. This is stuff purchased at five and dimes.
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kiara
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posted on September 20, 2003 04:54:02 PM new
I was curious about the style of chain as I didn't believe it to be from the 20's so I did some research on this and I found the identical necklace in C. Jeanenne Bell's 4th edition of Old Jewelry on page 311.
No, this was not high quality jewelry from the 20's. It is costume jewelry from the 40's and it was a very pretty piece but does show wear, proving that the durability is not there if worn too often.
The chain is slightly different but the S link or serpentine chain on Lucy's looks to be a chain that was used on jewelry in the 1940's so pieces may have varied slightly.
[ edited by kiara on Sep 20, 2003 04:58 PM ]
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fenix03
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posted on September 20, 2003 04:59:32 PM new
Kiara - you scare me sometimes 
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
Men Are Like Grapes. If You Stomp on Them and Keep Them in the Dark Long Enough, They Might Turn Into Something That You Would Take to Dinner
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Libra63
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posted on September 20, 2003 05:09:33 PM new
It's no good, Kiara; these "experts" just know more than you or I
Sorry Kiara I was referring to something that Fluffy said and the reference to shouting was Auction Ace and fluffy. I know you Kiara have great knowledge about costume jewelry and also fluffy. But there are a lot of others on this board and I myself think I know a lot about 50's costume but surely not an expert.
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kiara
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posted on September 20, 2003 05:15:46 PM new
Fenix, I scare myself sometimes. 
Actually I've collected junk jewelry for many years and I have boxes of it that I play with on occasion because I love it.
The picture I showed was scanned from a black and white photo and when I look closely I think the chain may be identical to Lucy's. It is a pretty piece.
That's okay Libra. I get in trouble so often that when someone mentions something I automatically think I'm the guilty one. You've sold many beautiful jewelry pieces and I don't know how you can part with them.
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ohmslucy
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posted on September 20, 2003 05:18:32 PM new
Wow, Kiara! You are simply amazing!
It's identical except for the stone color and, as you mentioned, the chain style.
I appreciate that you took the time to find it for me.
Thank you very much.
Lucy
Watch the donut, not the hole.
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kiara
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posted on September 20, 2003 05:37:42 PM new
You're welcome, Lucy.
I have lots of books and don't look at many of them often enough anymore. It was fun to actually find a piece that was in one of them.
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Japerton
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posted on September 20, 2003 05:45:53 PM new
So, are those rivets? They sure look like it.
~~~~~~~~~~~**~~~~~~~~~~~
All the monkeys aren't in the zoo,
Every day you meet quite a few,
So you see it's all up to you.
You can be better than you are,
You could be swingin' on a star
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ohmslucy
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posted on September 20, 2003 05:51:39 PM new
Kiara, I just ordered the book.
Which means hopefully next time I'll be able to find what I need by myself. Of course the 4th Ed. wasn't available but I guess the latest one will be pretty much the same.
Ordered another similar book at the same time (Amazon Free Shipping) which I hope will be useful also.
Thanks again,
Lucy
Watch the donut, not the hole.
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fenix03
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posted on September 20, 2003 06:11:47 PM new
Where are you guys seeing rivets? I am the first to admit that I know NOTHING about vintage jewelry ( I am learning some interesting tidbits from reading the various threads here though ) but the only thing I see are what I would assume is a series of reinforced sections at the connection points for the rhinestone star settings which would be a logical structural addition to keep the pieces from breaking off, especially if the core metal is something as soft as pewter.
Am I totally off base here? Am I referring to a completely different detail? What's the story
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
Men Are Like Grapes. If You Stomp on Them and Keep Them in the Dark Long Enough, They Might Turn Into Something That You Would Take to Dinner
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