posted on January 8, 2006 06:43:29 AM
12 Dead After Helicopter Crashes in Iraq
Updated 8:31 AM ET January 8, 2006
BAGHDAD, Iraq (AP) - A Black Hawk helicopter believed to be carrying 12 people has crashed in northern Iraq, and all aboard were killed, the U.S. military said Sunday.
Linda_K
posted on January 7, 2006 08:36:17 PM
.....look at all the name calling insults.....so unlike most of the liberals here
posted on January 8, 2006 06:46:54 AM
Dbl, you never cease to amaze me.
Linda, do you really believe that your silly and uninformed attempts to insult me and others here personally will divert attention from this very serious concern for the welfare of the troops?
Stop calling my name in your pitiful pleas for attention. I prefer not to confront or argue with people who in my opinion are sick or too ignorant to respond.
Get back to your hand holding activity and get back to those who will accomodate and reciprocate your obsequious ass-sucking sounds and to those indiscriminating fence straddlers who will occassionally use your ignorance as a wall against which they may show off their ability to bat down illogical thought.
BTW... I see that you are back atOTWA. Awwww....too bad there's no one there with a welcome mat to hold your hand and kiss your boo boos....not even Mucklepeas.
Now, rather than campaign to make sure that life saving armor is made available to the troops, the arm-chair neocons are trying to claim that the life saving equipment will be uncomfortable to wear ...ie that the troops will be uncomfortable before they die of gun shot wounds to the torso.
Your only concern for the troops is that they continue to be good fodder in a battle whose cause has not been defined. Shame on you all.
posted on January 8, 2006 07:14:20 AM
What’s detrimental to our military and anti American? It’s taking a biased written article like this and falsely concluding it to be a conspiracy
"12 Dead After Helicopter Crashes in Iraq”
And if they had better body armor, this wouldn't have happened?
Star trek had deflector shields since the 1960's., how come our troops don't have them today? WHERE’S OUR FORCE FIELDS?
desquirrel had the shortest and to the point post:
“The study is part of an on going quandry within the military. Of course, mainly out of stupidity, the lefties create their own conclusion.
Armor is a trade-off of protection, weight, and mobility. It is constantly evolving depending on the data collected. The troops today face a different enemy and tactics than ever before. The armor was not designed for this. In studying the casualties they discovered deaths caused by fragments that bypassed the armor. So the question becomes whether or not the armor should be extended to these areas in exchange for a decrease in mobility.
Just think the glee Helen et al could have if casualties increased because troops couldn't move fast enough to get out of the way.
It's a win-win situation. But only for left wing morons.”
If any of you pinkholes read the original article you would have seen:
"But Army and Marine Corps officials say developing, producing and fielding better armor is a constant effort as the military faces ever-changing and more lethal insurgent tactics in Iraq. An important consideration, they say, is the trade-off between heavier armor and troops' ability to move quickly and return fire."
"As we find the battlefield has changed, we constantly are trying to enhance the survivability and mobility of the American soldier," said Army spokesman Paul Boyce. "Throughout the fielding of body armor to our soldiers, improvements have been made and continue to be made." He cited five different upgrades to protective vests, as well as enhanced ceramic plates."
posted on January 8, 2006 07:15:35 AM
Helen, why is it that if anyone else agrees with Linda or her republican POV's (not just this issue - any issue) they are obsequious? Should we all agree on one thing all the time?
Did you see the new roller derby? I think I saw kraft and maggie in her fishnets on there?????
.
.
[ edited by dblfugger9 on Jan 8, 2006 07:17 AM ]
posted on January 8, 2006 07:18:53 AM
Helen, its not a matter of being uncomfortable...how fast can you move or run with an extra 40-50 lbs on your back?
posted on January 8, 2006 07:26:01 AM
Dbl - check out Rollergirls on A&E. Its anbout a womens league in Austin Texas. Caught an episode last week. Reminded me of when I was a kid and wanted to do that.
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
Never ask what sort if computer a guy drives. If he's a Mac user, he'll tell you. If he's not, why embarrass him? - Tom Clancy
posted on January 8, 2006 07:28:34 AM
lol fenix, i just saw that they said it runs on there. I will have to watch it. Is it as brutal as it used to be - or more so?
I remember as a kid watching it too. But then after awhile, you notice some of the moves (the elbows or whatever) started to look fake like the wrestling is now. Thats no fun.
Do you skate? You should go do it. Just for the fun or experience of it. On that show they told how the women are so varied. One is a computer tech, the other a medical worker...they dont get paid tho.
[ edited by dblfugger9 on Jan 8, 2006 07:41 AM ]
posted on January 8, 2006 07:51:29 AM
The league they show on the A&E show does not seem quite as bad as what used to play back when I was a kid (maybe it just looked worse then). I would love to do it but I think that means I would have to live in Texas and ...well.... I'll leave that to the parents. I have no idea where my skates are anymore although if I ever find them I am prepared. My keyring is my old rollerskate key
The A&E show league is skater owner so they just basically make whatever is left at the end of the day. They are everything from stay at home moms to school teachers to nurses. I think it's great.
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
Never ask what sort if computer a guy drives. If he's a Mac user, he'll tell you. If he's not, why embarrass him? - Tom Clancy
posted on January 8, 2006 08:15:17 AMNow, rather than campaign to make sure that life saving armor is made available to the troops, the arm-chair neocons are trying to claim that the life saving equipment will be uncomfortable to wear ...ie that the troops will be uncomfortable before they die of gun shot wounds to the torso.
Tell us again Helen, how much combat experience do you have?
"“More Iraqis think things are going well in Iraq than Americans do. I guess they don’t get the New York Times over there.”—Jay Leno".
I'm sure, bear that those people at the Pentagon who conducted this study have the military experience that you seem to require. They have concluded that simply enlarging the existing shields would save lives.
posted on January 8, 2006 08:45:21 AM
""What’s detrimental to our military and anti American? It’s taking a biased written article like this and falsely concluding it to be a conspiracy
"12 Dead After Helicopter Crashes in Iraq”"""
You thought this was a conspiracy ???
Where'd you get that idea ?....sounded pretty straightforward to me ....
didn't see any bias either, just a report of a helicopter crash.....now you neoconjobs don't want anything reported about the war ????"?????
posted on January 8, 2006 09:00:13 AM
Mingotree, you just slap around these deaths to prove your own point. Oh, Tale bearer of bad news you enjoying being for your own sick self-satisfaction. Maybe one days the "news" will hit you where it belongs and you can join that fart guy and disintegrate into space.
posted on January 8, 2006 09:13:57 AM
Besides 12 dead Americans in the Black Hawk. 5 U.S. Marines were slain in separate weekend attacks, the military said Sunday.
posted on January 8, 2006 09:28:22 AM
So sorry Dble that you just want to forget the people DYING for you...I don't want YOU or anyone else to show such disrespect to our troops by ignoring their sacrifices.
Oh, and as to the death threat......I'll just hang on to this
dblfugger9
posted on January 8, 2006 09:00:13 AM new
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mingotree, you just slap around these deaths to prove your own point. Oh, Tale bearer of bad news you enjoying being for your own sick self-satisfaction. Maybe one days the "news" will hit you where it belongs and you can join that fart guy and disintegrate into space.
posted on January 8, 2006 09:42:20 AM Your concern about weight and comfort is addressed by those with military experience, Bear.
Military officials said they had originally decided against using the extra plates because they were concerned they added too much weight to the vests or constricted the movement of soldiers. Marine Corps officials said the findings of the Pentagon study caused field commanders to override those concerns in the interest of greater protection.
"As the information became more prevalent and aware to everybody that in fact these were casualty sites that they needed to be worried about, then people were much more willing to accept that weight on their body," said Major Wendell Leimbach, a body armor specialist with Marine Corps Systems Command, the marine procurement unit.
And of course the troops on the ground in Iraq recognize the need. The question is why do you object, poobear?
"Almost from the beginning, some soldiers asked for additional protection to stop bullets from slicing through their sides. In the fall of 2003, when troops began hanging their crotch protectors under their arms, the Army's Rapid Equipping Force shipped several hundred plates to protect their sides and shoulders. Individual soldiers and units continued to buy their own sets."
posted on January 8, 2006 09:48:48 AMOh, and as to the death threat......I'll just hang on to this
And what are you going to do with it, hanger-on'er? Report me to vendio like you did Piinthesky? Oh, but then your friends will be calling you snitch!!
LOL! Telling you to ignite yourself with your own gas is a death threat?! ROFL!!! You need to hook up with that photo special chick..you really do.
Difference between me and you crowfart - I dont need to "hang-on" to anything on this internet or this message board. And thank god for that. Like another one needs to have your virtual reality gimme gimme disease.
.
[ edited by dblfugger9 on Jan 8, 2006 10:06 AM ]
[ edited by dblfugger9 on Jan 8, 2006 10:06 AM ]
posted on January 8, 2006 10:05:10 AM
I remember those who laughed throughout the topic each time more deaths were reported and compared them to traffic accidents and casually brushed it off as 'sh!t happens'. So I guess the 80% figure doesn't equate with them?
Nothing has changed here except that they seem to have even less concern for the troops now as more are killed daily.
posted on January 8, 2006 10:19:26 AM
And remember how they used to compare deaths in Iraq to a hot time in the city? They went so far as to claim that GI's were safer in Iraq than in Washington D.C.
And here, they would rather discuss the roller derby.
posted on January 8, 2006 10:26:16 AM
And here, they would rather discuss the roller derby.
LOL! And what do you think your 'discussing' of it changes here, Helen? Is all of Washington DC clamoring to see what the consensus opinion is on the vendio RT, and will thus take the appropriate actions from it?
At least I can see a stupid message board for what it is.
posted on January 8, 2006 10:31:54 AM
good grief Helen. Just because every so often someone would like to enjoy a lite moment and not forever carry the weight of the #*!@ world on their shoulders 24/7 does not mean that they do not care.
Can't people occasionally just have a little good natured fun without being told that they are evil and uncaring.
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
Never ask what sort if computer a guy drives. If he's a Mac user, he'll tell you. If he's not, why embarrass him? - Tom Clancy
posted on January 8, 2006 10:40:02 AM
And, remember this brave soldier who penned Rumsfeld down with a question he could not answer?
U.S. Army Spc. Thomas Wilson, left, questions Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld in Kuwait.
"Why do we soldiers have to dig through local landfills for pieces of scrap metal and compromised ballistic glass to up-armor our vehicles, and why don't we have those resources readily available to us?" was the blunt question that Army Spc. Thomas Wilson of the 278th Regimental Combat Team put to Rumsfeld, who was visiting soldiers at Camp Buehring, Kuwait, on the eve of their deployment into Iraq.
After asking Wilson to repeat his question, which garnered cheers among the 2,300 troops assembled, a somewhat startled Rumsfeld replied, "As you know, you go to war with the army you have, not the army you might want or wish to have at a later time." You could almost hear the implied "young man" that Rumsfeld would have loved to tack on to his condescending reply.
But Rumsfeld's headmaster-style pushback, so effective in dealing with timid reporters inside Pentagon briefing rooms, did not stem the flow of tough questions, as troops peppered him about the Pentagon's "stop loss" program, which forces volunteer troops to serve longer than expected. "Settle down, settle down," Rumsfeld said at one point, trying to regain control. "I'm an old man and it's early in the morning. I'm gathering my thoughts here."
posted on January 8, 2006 10:48:11 AM
Fenix, I am sorry if I misinterpreted your participation in Dbl's effort to change the topic to a discussion of the roller derby.
~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~ • ~~~
Never ask what sort if computer a guy drives. If he's a Mac user, he'll tell you. If he's not, why embarrass him? - Tom Clancy
posted on January 8, 2006 01:57:12 PM
Helen, I addressed you comment:
ow, rather than campaign to make sure that life saving armor is made available to the troops, the arm-chair neocons are trying to claim that the life saving equipment will be uncomfortable to wear ...ie that the troops will be uncomfortable before they die of gun shot wounds to the torso.
The kids I have talked to that are returning from Iraq have all told me the same thing.
1) If it it your time to go, no vest or trauma plate will save you.
2) They would rather have more freedom of movement and not be restricted by bulky & cumbersome vests and capes.
3) Freedom of movement affords them a quicker reaction time. Speed saves lives.
So, helen YOU haven't addressed my question. How much combat experience do you have? How many hours have you worn body armor while shooting & scooting. How many hours have you been in 120 degree heat wearing full combat gear.
Come Miss Queen of hypocrisy, rise from your gilded armchair and enlighten us with your vast personal knowledge of combat, not what you have read or someone told you, but your first hand experience.
"“More Iraqis think things are going well in Iraq than Americans do. I guess they don’t get the New York Times over there.”—Jay Leno".
[ edited by Bear1949 on Jan 8, 2006 02:01 PM ]
posted on January 8, 2006 02:11:04 PM
Strangely, in talking to the dozen or so troopers who have passed through my brother's house, they ALL seem to have "theories" 180 degrees from our whack pack here. They must all be deluded.
